Starting The Kindling Project
In our flagship episode, Amy and Melissa stumble their way through their first attempt at recording a podcast. They do not know how, where, and why they decide to take a leap of faith and make a recording. Starting somewhere while dreaming, supporting, and empowering one another, Amy and Melissa get vulnerable with their “why.” Although it does take them the morning to set up the microphone stand, they eventually sit down and press the record button. Amy and Melissa share why they decided to leap of faith and see where they land their feet. This podcast was recorded at the height of COVID-19 Summer 2020.
Learn more about The Kindling Project at our website: https://www.thekindlingproject.com/ and join our Facebook group for women looking for that extra kindling to start their next big fire! The Kindling Project - Ignite. The Kindling Project is sponsored by Memora, an experience design agency that creates memorable brand experiences. Memora is offering our listeners a FREE 30-minute brand consultation. Schedule yours now.
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Amy: Hi,
Melissa: welcome to the Kindley podcast. This is our first episode. I'm sitting here with my bestie, Amy and Amy, and I decided that we
Amy: would start a podcast.
Melissa: Yay. Here we are. So, what are we doing here, Amy? What are we talking about
Amy: today? Well, hello everyone. My name is Amy, as Melissa said, and, uh, Melissa and I are very excited because we are going to share something that we have been talking about for at least.
Two years, I would say, but there's, there's at least a, a decade behind us, of, of the, the seeds being planted for kindling and Melissa and I are going to talk today a little bit about, um, some of the things in terms of how we met some of the personal information about us and, um, our connection and some of the goals that we have for our podcast and, um, things along that line.
So. Yeah, that's right. So let's just get to know us a little bit more.
Melissa: So, Amy, do you wanna talk about
Amy: how we met? Yes, I would love to. So this is a, this is a, a unique story. I know Melissa and I were talking about this the other day and, and. Rekindling, um, what we, you know, where we've come and, and where we started.
So Melissa and I, um, we'll talk a little bit about where we grew up, but in 2004, we both moved to a brand new subdivision located in Northville, Michigan. And, uh, we were able to meet, because we had two houses, basically down the street from each other. That's right. And it was a good time to be a young mom in the suburbs.
Melissa: Um, with our little kids, we were surrounded by people in the same place that we were in mm-hmm and, you know, we had our mom's night out and we had our mom's play date groups. And of course, some of us connected more than others, but Amy and I just sort of stayed connected, you know? throughout the years, living in the neighborhood, not living in the neighborhood.
I left the state and lived in a couple other states and came back and, um, we just kept, you know, we just kind of kept scratching the same itch that, uh, she and I were sharing, um, a connection based on our age and our politics and our spirituality. We both have a deep interest in yoga and feminism. and these are kind of the starter topics, I think, for the podcast.
Amy: Mm-hmm mm-hmm so what's interesting though, is that Melissa actually met my sister Christine first? Yes. So we were into, I don't know. Well, it was, it was may mm-hmm because I was actually in the hospital having my third son, Cole. God bless you. Oh, gosh, no kidding. I should have stayed in the. Hospital. And so you, my sister was staying there with the other boys, Jack and RO. Yeah. And so
Melissa: I was walking through the neighborhood with my sweet little two and a half year old, I think at the time. And she went face down into the pavement and had scabbed hands and knees, and Christine invited me into Amy's house. And I thought Christine lived in that house. I mean, she got me bandaid.
She was complaining about the laundry. She showed me your CA hall closet, organizers. . I mean, I really took me a while to figure out that. Christine was not my new neighbor. that my new neighbor was in the hospital having a baby. So, and Christine kind of is a connection point for Amy and I there's, um, you know, there's a sad story here, but yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, Christine was a special soul.
Amy: Yes. Yes. Pretty incredible. We'll definitely, we'll definitely shelf that. Mm-hmm um, but what was, what was pretty awesome about that whole encounter though? Is that at the time? Um, I mean, we, the, the neighborhood was so new, there wasn't even, um, landscaping for a lot of the houses.
And so when I came home from the hospital, Christine was so excited because she had this. Of all the moms that she had met and she put each mom wrote their name and their address and their kids and the age and all the kiddos were under five, I would say, yeah, babies, toddlers. They were, they were, and she was so excited.
And of course, you know, I had just had my third C-section, so I was a little spaced out, but little did we know that that that piece of paper would really be the beginning of lifelong friendships? For sure, for sure. So it was really, it was incredible. Um, and so, but I will, I do wanna circle back on this.
So as, as Melissa said that, um, we did meet, we did meet back then in 2004. Um, but there was a period where Melissa ended up moving out of the neighborhood. She moved to one state and then she moved to another state and there was a period during that time that I moved to another neighborhood and, um, Move back into this neighborhood.
Trust me, that's about three other podcasts that we could talk about that maybe we will at some point, but we moved back into this neighborhood and we bought the house that you and Matt built. Yeah.
Melissa: So Amy now lives in the house that I built and I live in a different house in this neighborhood, down the street from Amy again?
Yes. So, and we are the only crazy ladies. Who left this neighborhood and came back
Amy: were not, we're not. And you know,
Melissa: it's also part of the big, the larger sort of economic recession of oh 8 0 9. A lot of people were displaced. Um, but we had a special thing going and I think a lot of people, um, went away and came back to try to rekindle that.
Yes. And I think there's sort of a theme here going about where we are in our life at this at this juncture of, of, and that's how we got the name for the podcast is like what? What's in the fire.
Amy: Mm-hmm , you know, mm-hmm,
Melissa: what, what are the sparks, you know, for us gen X or girls, uh, kind of here at midlife. I don't know if that's a bad word for some of us, but that's where we are.
Mm-hmm and, uh, for me personally, I feel like. Um, what am I doing next? Right. What's important. Right? Or what haven't I gotten done that I better get
Amy: to it. Mm-hmm mm-hmm yeah, that's a good point. Well, one of the things that I'm most excited about, but you'll find I'm excited about a lot of things is that I turned 50 in, um, December and I feel really for the first time that.
The sky's the limit. Um, you know, the boys are older. My oldest will be 19. Middle will be 17 and the youngest will be 15 and they're all in high school. And thinking about, um, the fact that I now have. Some real choices of where I wanna take myself personally and professionally. And I think that's something that's brought us back that has really been stoking this kindling as, as you came up with your incredible ideas and we, I would expect you to come up with an awesome name like that, but we have been stoking this, this fire, um, throwing, throwing little, little, um, sticks and, and.
Spriggs and things like that over the years into this, because this is really how we have evolved into, into women, into friendship, into motherhood and, um, professionals and professionals.
Melissa: I mean, you're doing a great big career thing. Mm-hmm education thing right now, finishing up your PhD.
Amy: Yes, you can get a PhD at 50.
My friend, I know isn't that something. And I've even had a couple people say, well, why are you getting a PhD now? And I thought, well, why not? You know, it's like, wow, am I, do I have one foot in the grave? Like, is it, you know, um, had I, like, I never even thought for a minute that I'm too old. I mean, first of all, I could never have even done this program at a younger age.
It's or with kids running around? No, nor would I have wanted to, but it takes so much, um, planning and discipline and time management. And really teenage years is a perfect time because the only time the boys need me is when they're hungry or when they want money . So I can be in my corner working and researching and they, I just throw them money under the door and they're happy.
Oh, I wish mine just needed
Melissa: money. I could solve their problems so much easier.
Amy: Give it time you're you're around the corner from that. Trust me.
Melissa: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think I have a similar juncture where I'm not getting a PhD, but. I'm rounding off a decade of running a design agency and a successful design agency with, uh, you know, clients that I love and work that I'm proud of and women who will be my lifelong partners that have worked with me and for me and for my clients, um, on projects.
Over the years, but it's time for something else.
Amy: Mm-hmm mm-hmm and just like people
Melissa: ask you why PhD now mm-hmm people ask me, why would you walk away from a successful business? Mm-hmm like, are you crazy? Everyone's trying to start a business, but you know, I have a itch. Yeah. Yeah. I have a itch. Maybe it's this podcast.
Um, maybe it's something. Right.
Amy: Well, so let's talk it out and I don't think we're
Melissa: alone. And that's what I think is at the root of this
Amy: is that we're probably not alone. Right. Right. Well, I, I know we're not, because now I'm seeing clients again. And I know there's a lot of women out there. Um, and you know, I did did some research on gen Xers and we are definitely a unique generation, uh, in terms of, um, How a lot of us were raised and how we parent and where we're going now.
And, um, you even said in doing some research that there's really a gap for our generation in terms of, um, the needs out there. Right. You know, we know that there's the, I believe it's the gen Z, the millennials, um, What's after millennials, gen X. It is gen X. Okay. Yeah. That, yeah. And then our parents are the boomers.
Yes. Which my boys, not anymore, but they like to call me a boomer and I'm like, I'm not a boomer. Okay. Yeah, let's get that very clear. But I think that's a
Melissa: common misnomer. I mean, I think gen X has, um, kind of specifically been antisocial. We're not known for being joiners and particip
Amy: mm-hmm
Melissa: and, um, we're a little forgotten mm-hmm I think I remember being at a marketing conference many years ago, where the speaker was talking about in terms of marketing to gen X, that we weren't a large enough generation to spend your ad dollars.
that, that they were gonna skip right from boomers. Wow. To millennials in terms of ad spend, because, you know, it's hard to harness us into one group. Mm-hmm we have a really diverse, um, set of personality traits and likes and dislikes. And you know, we're not a big generation. I don't know if this is the accurate number, but I think that there's like three to.
Um, to us on
Amy: either side of us. Oh, interesting. Yeah. That's interesting. Wow. So it must have been then the boomers not having as many
Melissa: kids. Yeah. I think that's it. I think they didn't have as many kids as their parents had. Yeah. And then I think, I mean, this isn't, this isn't social science here. This is your that's your space.
Okay. You can check my data, but I also. But there's a lot of millennials because the boomers had two families, a lot of them divorced and started a second family.
Amy: Yes, yes. That, yep. That's a really good point. Yeah, definitely. That's. Yeah. And I could see the, I could see that and I could see the, the independence too, because I think a lot of us were what they would call latchkey kids.
Yep. So our parents were working, whether it was a single parent. I grew up in a single parent home and my mom was working. Right. So my sister, you know, the big story with her is she had to, you know, turn on the crock pot and feed us food. Cuz you know, my mom was basically on the east side, driving back from being a school.
So social worker. So you that's, that's true. There's definitely a lot of independence and that's, we, we really had to be independent if we wanted to survive in a lot of ways. Oh
Melissa: absolutely. I, I was also a latchkey kid. Um, not a single parent home, but. Both of my parents worked. My mom was kind of out there on the front of the feminist movement.
Mm-hmm , you know, she went back to school and got her master's and her master's after she had us kids climbed the corporate ladder. Um, which I think that a lot of, a lot of the, um, people in our generation saw how hard that was. Mm-hmm mm-hmm and some of us kind of, while we still did both of those things, we didn't do them at the
Amy: same.
right, right. So that's something that you, you brought that up earlier, Melissa, about our personal connections and that's definitely something that I can say truthfully, is that that's something that has connected me to you is that there's a sense of, I would say a spiritual connection. There's um, a mindfulness connection.
we both love yoga. We are fierce feminists. Um, absolutely. And, um, we, I would say we vote, um, on probably the same side of the aisle. Now I wanna make it very clear to our listeners that, um, I, I, I don't want people to just turn off the podcast now because we may have political differences. Mm-hmm um, unfortunately we have evolved into this society and, and that's something I'm ho I'm hoping that we can come back, um, to having.
different discussions. It's okay to have discussions where we're not gonna agree. Right. And that's something we've really lost. Um, you know, back in the day, I remember, I mean, who didn't have family, um, holiday dinners and there were two different, uh, political parties. People are disagreeing. Mm-hmm and.
but then you just pass the Turkey or you pass the dressing and you just go on. Right. You know, and, and that's something that is really important. I think, um, for, for me to, to hone in on that, is that our listeners, the women, um, because I, I have, I have a lot of friends of all different walks of life in some, you know, we, we all have different outlooks.
Um, although, you know, quite a few are the same, but the point is, is that. that's been something that we've had. Is that personal connection, right? Right.
Melissa: Well, I think while you're busy healing, the national divide, you might have to work on healing me as well. I'm still sort of avoiding family Thanksgiving.
even another year or two.
Amy: Yeah, it is the national divide. You're so right. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Yeah.
Melissa: I, um, I'm the more bleeding heart of the bleeding heart.
Amy: Here. Yeah. I love that. I love that. You said that the national divide cuz it's so true, you know? Yeah. And you know, it's so interesting too, that, um, something that one thing I I've learned is that people don't like to have any type of conflict.
They don't like to have any kind of confrontation. So they don't. Have any, but with what happened in the last four years with our administration, we went, we went from having no conflict to anybody and anyone could, could do and say whatever they wanted regardless.
Melissa: Well, I think that's the safety of the keyboard in the phone.
That's true. You know, that's true. Everybody's everybody is like a town crier now, but they have no repercu. Right. I see all kinds of things. Even people I never expected from, um, happening online that that same person would never say
Amy: or behave that with the person mm-hmm yeah. Yeah. That's such a good point.
Just doing it on. Yeah. I'm sorry. What did you say that it, it, it
Melissa: emboldens people. Yeah. You know, sometimes to. , you know, be a little more
Amy: aggressive mm-hmm than they would be in person, right? Yes. That's so true. I know it just, it's a, it's a false sense of, um, of security and mm-hmm, pretty frightening, but, but we know that between us there's that personal connection, um, right.
Being able to talk about books, about, um, authors, about movements, um, going to the women's March. Yes. Yes. Yes. So, you know, being able to do different things I think is, is it's important because it's, you know, when we, when we were really in that, um, in the heart of the tsunami of motherhood, I mean, I know we're still in it, but really raising the kids and being busy and doing all this driving around and, and all this kind of stuff.
We didn't have a lot of time to sit and have these conversations at all. and now we can really sit with a cup of tea if we'd like to. Yeah. And, and digest and process mm-hmm .
Melissa: And, and I think that's a space where we're doing it, you and I on our way to yoga or, um, on a walk on our walk around the neighborhood.
But I feel like it's a good space. Um, a podcast is a good medium for us to be doing that. Mm-hmm because I think, I think a lot of women are in this
Amy: place right now of what happened. what
Melissa: happened? Uh, you know, politically and socially and culturally what happened to my body? yes. What happened to my face.
Right, right, right. Yeah. I think there's some processing mm-hmm at the point that you and I are at. Um, that's
Amy: a meaningful conversation. Definitely. Definitely. So let's talk a little bit about some personal, I have some personal questions I wanna ask you. All right. Um, and I, I wanna let the audience know that we we're gonna get into some personal questions, um, in this podcast.
And then we'll, we'll move into some professional, um, questions and delve into a little, because I know that Melissa mentioned she. Has this very successful, um, experienced design agency, uh, that brands and markets, um, all this kind of stuff. That, to be honest with everybody, I don't know a lot about, but I know she's very good at it.
And I've seen her work and I know you really glossed over that, but, uh, it's a pretty successful business. This isn't just, you know, this isn't just, it's not a hobby. No, no. You've made a career out of it. It's so, I mean, yes. And so I really wanna to highlight that because I truly admire your success.
Thanks. So, um, tell me, tell, tell me and tell the audience, tell me where you grew up. so
Melissa: I grew up in Southeast Detroit suburbs. Okay. Uh, most of my childhood was spent in Shelby township, which is Macomb county, Michigan. And, um, You know, it was a pretty typical suburban middle class, upper middle class upbringing.
Mm-hmm I mean, very privileged. Um, I'm grateful to have had the childhood and the education that I have, my parents did move when I was in high school. So I spent, um,
Amy: I spent one year, uh, at a different high school in
Melissa: Rochester, Michigan, but essentially they're neighboring towns. Mm-hmm mm-hmm and I do think Midwest, uh, being from the Midwest, being from Michigan, being a Metro Detroiter is certainly the formative part of.
Amy: Who I am. Yes. Who you are.
Melissa: Definitely. I know. Um, there's kind of an east side, west side thing with us. You grew up yes. You
Amy: wanna tell them where you grew up? Yep. So I grew up in Dearborn, Michigan and Dearborn is basically most known for Ford motor company. And so everybody in Dearborn probably except our family drove a Ford.
Yeah. Uh, which I didn't really know. That was a big deal until I got older. Yeah. Uh, because basically every, all of my friends, their dad worked at Ford. Yeah. My dad was an engineer at Ford. Right. See, it was just the, you know, we have the big three in, in the Detroit area. So yeah, my mom
Melissa: was a computer programer she was an it, an it management at Chrysler
Amy: at one point in her career.
Yeah, I mean, that was that's people's bread and butter and I get it, but being a first generation Italian, um, my family drove Volkswagens and my grandparents brought a Mercedes over, you know, so it was like, we didn't have Fords, but I'll never forget, um, passing a UAW when I. In high school and there was a sign that said, um, no foreign cars all allowed in the parking lot.
Yeah. I've seen those and I'm like, I get that now, you know, I get that and I would go to friend's house and their dads didn't want me to park in the driveway. Huh. And I'm just, you know, it's still going on all over the Detroit today. Oh, of course. Absolutely. And I get it, I get it now, but it was just, it was, you know, I, I mean, my mom raised, uh, a twin brother.
Uh, his name is Timothy and then, um, our sister, Christine she's three years older than. And, um, you know, she, she basically raised us and worked full time and all that kind of stuff, but, um, she wasn't connected to the OS. She wasn't, she was a school social worker. Well, and even Matt
Melissa: and I, I mean, Matt and I have worked in design and.
Um, in one form or other, our whole careers, I started out in museum, so that wasn't automotive heavy, but since moving back to Michigan, a lot of my clients are automotive related. Mm-hmm , mm-hmm , you know, manufacturers and auto suppliers and auto dealers. And, um, That's just part of
Amy: Michigan culture.
Absolutely. And I'll tell you when, when the recession hit, I believe in oh eight. I, I told Sean, my husband, I said, I, what all the cars were getting moving forward, have to be Fords. You know, I just felt so compelled. Um, and so. There's my little, but I, I do really love Mustangs. Just as a side note. Did you have a Mustang?
I did. Yes. We had a Mustang Cole, my youngest, he, he always names our cars. And so that was called bumblebee. No thinking back, it was such a great car, but I really don't know what. We were thinking.
Melissa: Yeah. Well, how did you put three big teenage boys in the
Amy: back seat of that thing? Well, we didn't, I mean, ,
Melissa: that was your getaway
Amy: card.
Yeah, exactly, exactly. But financially it was like, why did we do that? You know, that's the whole other conversation, but it's like, my gosh, like. This is not a good idea, but it was fun. Yeah. It was fun to drive cuz it was a stick shift and I learned how to drive a stick. That's how I learned to drive was on.
Um, do you remember the Volkswagen rabbits? Yeah. Yeah. My dad took my brother and I to a parking lot and that's how we learned how to drive was on a, a rabbit. So, um, so tell me, tell me, okay, so you grew up in Shelby township, but you graduated. Did you graduate from the high school in Shelby? So
Melissa: I went, um, I grew up in Shelby township.
I went to high school in Shelby township and then my parents moved my summer between 10th and 11th grade. And I had kind of, um, I had a pretty big network of friendship. That extended beyond my own high school. Mm-hmm so when my parents moved to the neighboring town in Rochester, I had, I, I had friends at that other high school mm-hmm and I thought it would be fun and it would be novel to just change high schools.
And I did change high schools for my 11th grade year. And then the summer between 11th and 12th grade, I went to Japan as a foreign exchange student. And I really, I think there was some home sickness there and there was a lot of thinking about coming back and finishing my final year of high school.
Mm-hmm and I decided for my senior year to go back to Shelby township and graduate with the. Kids that I had known, you know, essentially
Amy: since second grade. Yeah. So you went to school with the same kids from elementary to middle to high school and then, yeah. And
Melissa: then I had one year off. It was kind of a year and a half because I did a year of, um, I did a year of 11th grade in Rochester and then I did a summer of 11th grade in Japan.
And then I came back and did my
Amy: senior year in Shelby. Wow. That was brave. That was really brave for a high schooler to do that. Yeah. Especially going to, to Japan. Now, did you live with a host family? I did. I lived with a wonderful host family. And did their child come and live with your family? Not their
Melissa: child, but it was an exchange.
I believe it was sponsored through the Kiwanis club. So we did have a Japanese foreign exchange student who lived with us the entire school year, my 10th grade year. And
Amy: she's still a dear friend now did. was this related to the same family you live with when you went? No. Okay. It wasn't a
Melissa: direct exchange.
They, you know, they placed Japanese, um, students with Americans and they placed Americans with Japanese families, but you didn't necessarily live with each other's
Amy: family. Right, right, right. That must have been an incredible experience. What was, if you had one takeaway from that summer in Japan, what would it be?
I
Melissa: really think I got out of that Shelby bubble. Mm-hmm mm-hmm that bubble that so many high schoolers are in where they haven't left their hometown. Right. Or they've taken a vacation to Florida. Yes. You know, or maybe if they're really lucky, their parents took come to Europe from Mexico. Right. You know, or they've driven across the border to Canada here from Detroit, but yeah.
Um, just seeing the other side of the globe. And, um, that sort of culture, cultural exposure really opens up the world for kids. Absolutely. I, um, I have been pushing on my daughter. She's been taking Spanish since second grade that she should do a foreign exchange to Spain or to south America. And she just has no interest.
Mm-hmm I, I I'm losing ground on that. Yeah, yeah. Front, but I, I would love for either of my kids to have that experience. And I would recommend it to anybody's kids.
Amy: Right. Right. Well, without going too much off the, the grid, one of the things though that's interesting is, you know, back then you, you know, we only had the TV or we had the newspaper or the magazines in some ways.
And I don't know if you know this, I didn't even have a TV growing
Melissa: up. No, my parents were kinda. Hippie dippy in that sense, we had no junk food, no TV in our house. Oh, so it was like a strip weird house. Yes. No one wanted to spend the night there. No kidding.
Amy: Are you kidding?
Melissa: Gosh, we, we would have to sneak over to my grandparents.
Thank God. They lived next door art to try some Hawaiian punch or some lays potato chips and, you know, watch some fantasy. I looked because there was no TV, no junk food at my house.
Amy: Wow. Your whole, like your whole childhood was deprived.
Melissa: She's I, yeah, I'm totally DED when it comes to cultural references.
When people quote, TV shows, you
Amy: know, I, so you didn't watch the Brady bunch. I mean, I've seen it a couple times at other people's houses. Wait Gilligan's islands. No, none of that Flinstones, none of that. No. I mean, I'm aware of it, right, right. But you don't know the series, the episodes. No, none of that.
Sanford and son, none of those, none of that. Wow. I never knew that that's that is crazy to me. Yeah. I mean, that's, I mean the newly we game, the newly, we show like that all, and that's why I'm such a weirdo, Amy I really had
Melissa: no idea. I'm like UN frozens caveman.
Amy: I, I mean, especially, I really think that was a big thing with gen Xers, because from what I remember, everybody had TV.
Yes. And that's what we did on Saturday mornings. We'd watch Saturday morning cartoons. Yeah, boy, you guys, my,
Melissa: what were guys doing? My parents did. new times in the Christian science monitor on the weekends.
Amy: well, okay. So that goes towards your, your, you are very smart, so I could see how, but wow. I mean, when you have
Melissa: nothing else to consume
Amy: gosh, not even, not even any good thing to snack on either either they did have a
Melissa: stack of magazines too.
I can remember we would get scientific American and national geographic mm-hmm psychology today. So big on the reading, but yes, not big on the
Amy: cultural norms, right? You couldn't. And that's interesting because one of the things that my brother and sister and I, we would have a contest, you know, when a Brady bunch came on or another show, we we'd see who could guess which one it was.
Because we had seen it more than once. Like, is it, you know, where Marsha gets her nose broken or is it when Greg gets his hair dye orange? I mean, yeah. We would just know these things. So that's really interesting. So, so back to Japan, that that must have been a pretty incredible experience. And then where did you go to college?
So
Melissa: initially my big dream was to go to art school. Okay. And so in high school I worked on a portfolio and that was my big dream. and my parents, both being executives at this point, they had different ideas. Mm-hmm they kind of felt like we're not gonna buy this expensive education and then you're gonna live in a van down by the river.
right. So I applied to art schools and they sort of put the Kash on that. So at the 11th hour, I hadn't applied to any other kinds of schools. And my parents were saying no to the art school thing. And so my best friend had gotten accepted to Michigan state.
Amy: So I
Melissa: decided, well, I guess I'll go to Michigan state with Mary Ellis.
And I applied to Michigan state and I got accepted and I went off to school in east Lansing and I was roommates with my high school best friend the first year. . Um, but I really, it really didn't work
Amy: out to me. Yeah. But I was a total fish outta water. Mm-hmm I could see that you imagine me at
Melissa: a yes.
Sorority party,
Amy: right? yeah. I could see where that would not work.
Melissa: Well, I had no cultural references from TV. Nobody wanted to talk scientific American with
Amy: me. Yeah. Well, plus it was so big. It was such a big school. Yeah. It still is. It's even bigger now. Yeah. It was just
Melissa: a giant environment. I mean, it's a, it's a fantastic school and I know people who have graduated from there.
They love it. It's their Alma mater. Yes. Yes. But I left after the first year mm-hmm I was just really lost there. Yeah. Um, and I came home and I got a job and I finished my degree at Oakland university. Okay. Kind of as a commuter student mm-hmm so I didn't really have the complete college experience other than that first year at Michigan state, because then I.
Renting a house with some friends and working and, you know, doing the kind of commuter student
thing.
Amy: Right. That when you do that too, you go almost more into adulthood quicker, right? Because you you're working, you're driving, you're commuting. Right. You know, where in, if you're living on campus, you're walking to class, you're maybe hungover or at least I was from the parties the night before and right.
It's a little bit more enmeshed. Um, so. Did you, did you end up getting your degree in art or what did you get your degree in sod
Melissa: in, uh, I, I got a degree in art history and studio art. Okay. Okay. So I, I still kind of got around the whole art thing even at a regular university. Mm-hmm um, I thought I was gonna major in like Japanese and, uh, international studies and I started there, but.
I did the art thing just always
Amy: kept calling me. Right. Well, you ended up doing that professionally. Obviously
Melissa: I did. And even after I got my bachelor's degree, I mean, I've been a lifelong student and, uh, you know, I went, I moved to San Francisco and I took postgrad classes at the art, um, the art school in San Francisco.
Mm-hmm mm-hmm and then I've taken art classes and architecture classes and design classes,
Amy: kind of my whole. mm-hmm mm-hmm I've really never stopped taking, going to school. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I would, I would think that in your industry, you're always, you're always evolving because of, of the industry.
There's always changes. It's not like you're just in this, this industry that, yeah. I mean, I can
Melissa: remember, I mean, I didn't so much start doing graphic and digital the work I do now, I started out working in museums on exhibits. Um, but we did a lot of our concepting by hand
Amy: mm-hmm drawings,
Melissa: um, sketches mm-hmm model building and everything is completely
Amy: digital now.
Yes. Yes. I bet everything is mm-hmm
Melissa: yeah, I still kind of think in, I still kind of think in real life
Amy: though. I'm not a, I'm not a online thinker so much.
Melissa: I mean, I know how to use the programs mm-hmm but. I still very much have a calling for art making and, and making things with
Amy: my hands. Yes. Yes. And you have beautiful artwork around your home that you've created as well.
Oh, thanks. You do. Yes. I, I know. I mean, wow. That's really impressive. And I'm married to an
Melissa: artist too. Yes. And, and even though he also works in the design space now, cause you know, that pays the bills. Mm-hmm both of us, if we could, would paint
Amy: pictures. yes. Yes. Mm-hmm . Yep. And, you know, I think as time goes on, you can evolve more towards that as well.
Yeah. You know? Um, I don't know, you know, just seeing how that looks, but you've definitely put in, you've definitely put in a lot of work, so, yeah. Um, is that right after you, after you graduated then, is that when you started working at the, um, Detroit institu. Tu art. Well, when I
Melissa: first, uh, graduated, I, um, I worked in an art gallery.
Okay. Here in
Amy: Birmingham, Michigan. That's where I met my husband. Okay. That's right. One of the artists, the gallery
Melissa: represented. Um, and then since then I moved to California. I worked at, uh, science centers and children's museums. Um, and then I came back to Detroit and I worked at the Detroit science center.
Mm-hmm um, so I, I, I, I, I did spend almost a decade in museums, either being employed by them or freelancing to them.
Amy: Okay. That's really impressive because the city of Detroit has, I, I can imagine what, I don't know if you remember the big
Melissa: expansion of the science center, but I was there during the time that okay.
Uh, I, I don't know if it, maybe it was a 90 million
Amy: project. It was a huge expansion. Wow. Of the. that's pretty impressive. Yeah. Were you a part of all of that then? Yeah, I was the
Melissa: developer for the children's gallery.
Amy: Wow. Wow. That's really, you have an impressive resume. Yeah. I don't know . I mean, those, those are, so those are so important.
Those are the, the backbone to so many cities, really those types of, um, are those considered nonprofits? Yeah. Okay. Okay. I, I, I think all museums. The general, our nonprofit. Yeah. That makes the most sense. There's no money in it. right. Exactly. You gotta have those fundraisers and like donors, we may have chosen our professions.
Melissa: definitely not, not being able to make a good living.
Amy: Right? Definitely not. Based on how much you can bring home. It's not a lot of money in social work either, right? No, no, not at all. How about you? Did you know what you wanted to do from a young age? Uh, I really didn't. I mean, there was a period where I wanted to be an actress.
Oh, I could see that. But then I realized life is a stage. So I'm just gonna, you
Melissa: really are an actress
Amy: already. Yeah, exactly. I remember I begged my mom to take me down to the Fisher theater. Mm-hmm it was probably about third grade because they were having trouts for Annie. Aw. And of course, you know, this was a 1970s, mom, she wasn't gonna take me outta school to do this, you know?
Right. So that was a flop, but I did do acting classes and I was in some shows in Dearborne through the community center, you know, through the civic center. Yeah. It wasn't even a community theater. It was like a, the civic center. Mm-hmm same place where they had the, the roller skating rink, you know, the Dearborn civic center was like the coolest place.
Yeah. It really was. Uh, so yeah, so. I, I, um, I ended up going to Ave college. Mm-hmm , which is 30 miles south of Lansing. I okay. You weren't too far away from each other at one point. Yeah. Yeah. I was not an ideal student though in high school or in college, because really high school. I just love to socialize.
Yeah, I know it's a shock, but it was all about socializing and not really prioritizing school and my grades and. It was just, it was just fun. Right? It was just fun times, you know, now am I gonna say it was a time of my life? Absolutely not. When people say, oh, these are the best years of your life who says that high school?
Yeah. I mean, that was a really short sighted statement. Whoever came up with that. But I do for
Melissa: me think like maybe 15 to 25, all of that socializing that you do and those friendships you build and those memories you make.
Amy: I'm not sure our kids are getting that. No, I agree. It's very different. It's very different.
Yeah, because we, we would go to each other's homes. We would write letters if we were gone in the summer. Yeah. We would call on the phone. I mean, kids now they text, they snap. They're not, it's not, they're not having those kinds of interpersonal communication. Yeah. And I think that's, that's a big part of it.
So, um, that's a whole topic. I think. It, it definitely is. So, um, but you got through, you graduated. I did. I did by the hair of my chinny chin chin, but it was, you know, I, it was a really, it was a great experience. Um, and it was a, it was a culture shock though, because a, that. Was very small mm-hmm um, the town literally has a blinking light in the town and I came from Dearborn public schools and, you know, that's strength.
Yeah. My class had about 350 mm-hmm at the time that was a lot of students. Right. And going to Ave, it was like, oh my gosh, what am I doing here? And. But, you know, honestly, if the truth be told, it was the only school I applied for and it was the only school I got into. Right. Because my grades weren't great.
I mean, they weren't horrible, but they weren't mm-hmm they weren't great. Um, did somebody advise you that that
Melissa: would be a good place for
Amy: you? Well, it's funny this, this man named Carl, who was a recruiter from all of that, he kept calling me and I'm like, who is this guy? Carl? How did he get my number? What and why does he want me at the school?
Mm-hmm well, it turned out my mom. My mom's brother Jim. He went to all it. He graduated from there. So my name must have rolled down some hill and it landed on someone's desk. Oh, that's what I'm thinking. Yeah, I don't, I have no idea. Your mom
Melissa: was like, just take her, right. Just take her I'll pig. Double.
Amy: Exactly. Just get this child out of my house as soon as possible. I mean, my mom, I. See, like the back of her car, the wheels just like spinning, like when she dropped me off at school. Yeah. But, um, but it turned out to be such a great experience. I mean, it was not easy mm-hmm um, in terms of, I mean, it's growing up, you know, it's, it's college, it's growing up, but I, I just absolutely loved it.
And I'm so glad, you know, unlike you going to Michigan state, I'm so grateful. I was at a small school. Yeah, because there was so much accountability. You know, right. If you didn't show up for class, the professor would call or, or people would come and get you, you know, exactly. It was a lot of accountability.
So it ended up being a really good fit for me. So, and you got, did you start off in social work? No. No. I, I ended up getting my, um, bachelor's in anthropology and sociology. Okay. you say, okay, well, what does one do with that while you go to grad
Melissa: school? Right, right, right. Because,
Amy: uh, you will be doing, you'll be flipping burgers if you don't.
Yeah. I mean, anthropology, I mean, what, you know, I love anthropology. I know. I know if I win the lotto,
Melissa: I'm gonna do a master's in anthropology for the hell.
Amy: Yes. It's. I mean, it's so, it's so interesting, but that really is the root in so many ways of social work. Right. You know, and I'll never forget sitting in.
My senior year. And it was just like, as if God just Tapp me on the shoulder and said, it's you gotta go get your MSW. Mm-hmm . Now my mom had her MSW, my grandma, Tina. Um, she didn't have an Ms. WW, but she was very servant service oriented type of person mm-hmm so, um, I grew up in that servant type.
Environment. Yeah. And, um, so that's, that's how I ended up getting my MSW. So you came by it naturally. It really did. It really did. And I'm so glad I did it because it's such a diverse degree, you know, and you know, we can definitely talk more about that. I think this is probably a good place to stop.
Melissa: Yeah, I agree.
I mean, We're we're rambling a bit, but it's a nice introduction. I, how we met and who we are. Yeah. Kind of where we're at in
Amy: life. Yeah. And this is probably good where we can pick up, um, with our episode two, because then we can talk more about our professional experience and what we've done. Mm-hmm and then what we're gonna focus on.
We're gonna, what we wanna do since we're, we're both new at this. We've been doing a lot. Um, brainstorming of different topics that we're gonna talk about. Yeah. So as our listeners get to learn a little bit more about us, it's important that we, um, are transparent and our listeners learn about us and, um, hopefully feel some sort of connection to us.
And, um, And we have some really exciting things that we're gonna focus on and talk about. I'm excited about it. I am too. And I think
Melissa: we have a lot, I, I think we'll get into some interesting guests and some interesting conversations. Yes. And maybe just fill a space. I know we both love podcasts and there's a, you know, everyone in their cat has one these days.
Right. But I'm still kind of convinced that there's a niche
Amy: for us. Yes. I agree. I agree. That's why we're here. So thank you to all our listeners. Um, even if there's one or two or it's our kids at this point. Yeah. Maybe. Just Matt and Sean now I know, I mean, I
Melissa: don't even know if Matt and Sean would've wanna listen to another hour of us and ya or not.
No kidding.
Amy: Um, but we do know we have husbands who are very supportive and, um, we're gonna leave you with the music that Matt who is, um, Melissa's incredibly talented husband. He came up with the music for our podcast kindling. So, uh, we will leave you with that. And yeah, here's a little Matt,
Melissa: uh, Stroman on his 1960s.
Gibson acoustic. There
Amy: you go. There you go.
Melissa: I would be remiss if I didn't
Amy: mention that. That would be, that would be unfortunate and I'm glad you did so everybody have a great day and stay safe. Bye now, byebye Amy. And
Melissa: I thought it would be nice in every episode to have a segment called the kindling. This is the part of the show where we want to create space for the tiny fire inside you.
That needs fuel and Fann. This week,
the kindling we'd like to share is our core values. When we started on this journey of creating the kindling project, one of the first things we did was discuss what are our shared core values. The four that we ended up with are be present. Be willing, be authentic and be fierce.
Amy: We
Melissa: challenge you to think about your core values, whether in a family.
A relationship, a partnership or a business. Once you can verbalize them, you can measure every decision
Amy: against them and ask yourself,
Melissa: is this serving my core values?