Take your creativity seriously
Amy Parravano Drummond interviews two of the ladies working behind the scenes on The Kindling Project! In this episode, they discuss the inner workings of creative minds and growing up surrounded by all types of art.
Catherine DiRosa is a recent college graduate who went to school at Manhattanville College and received a BA in Music Technology and Film. Since graduating, she has established a freelance career in the media and entertainment industries. she manages and edits 2 personal podcasts. 1 with her sisters and the other as a solo host giving tips and tricks for other creatives who want to get started in the freelance world. She has a passion for creativity and helping others.
Marielena Vincenza is an online student at Full Sail university working to complete her Bachelors in Graphic Design. Marielena spends her free time creating all sorts of projects and mostly prefers to illustrate digitally. She currently makes her own stickers and art prints and is working to turn that into her own small business. She is an avid animal lover, being the owner of 4 rats. She currently works as an intern under her sister and is learning how to freelance and work for herself.
Find Catherine's work here:
Learn more about The Kindling Project at our website: https://www.thekindlingproject.com/ and join our Facebook group for women looking for that extra kindling to start their subsequent big fire! The Kindling Project - Ignite. The Kindling Project is sponsored by Memora, an experience design agency that creates memorable brand experiences. Memora is offering our listeners a FREE 30-minute brand consultation. Schedule yours now.
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[00:00:00] Amy: Hello, Welcome to the Kindling Project Podcast! This is a show where we share stories from inspiring women all over, giving us insight into the people and processes that helped them bring their kindling project to fruition. Here and over in our Facebook group, The Kindling Project Ignite, We are about creating a space to empower and support women with any and all kind of individual aspirations.
[00:00:34] Melissa, my co-host, she is not here today. She is feeling under the weather, so unfortunately she is not here with us, but I am here! My name is Amy. I am a licensed social worker, a therapist, yoga instructor, mom, sister, friend, aunt, and so many other things. And, um, today I'm so excited that we get to have these unbelievable [00:01:00] young women in our group.
[00:01:01] Catherine and Marielena here joining us today on our, um, podcast. Welcome ladies. I'm so happy to have you both here. So, one of the first things that is really exciting to know about you two is that you're sisters! And the other cool fun fact that I just love is that Catherine, you're a twin. So tell, tell me the age? So the twins are....?
[00:01:25] Catherine: We are 23.
[00:01:26] Marielena: I turn 21 in November. I feel like I'm 17 still!
[00:01:31] Amy: I will tell you though, the farther I've gotten away from like, my twenties and thirties and forties, you know, you wanna stay in touch with the little girl inside, uh, the farther you get away from her, the more you wanna stay connected to her.
[00:01:45] So I'm just gonna get give you that little side note. So one of the, one of the reasons that we have you here both today is because you have been working with Melissa and I, and, um, I know I've, I've said this before, but I am so impressed [00:02:00] with both of you. You both are so smart and you're so talented, and one of, one of my mantras that I've always said is, I wanna surround myself with other women of all ages of all backgrounds who are smarter than me in things that I have no idea on, because then you help level me up and I can hopefully help level you both up, you know, in the areas that, that you need additional support in. And so, um, Catherine, tell us how you and Melissa connected and how you really came into the fold of the Kindling project.
[00:02:31] Catherine: Yeah, sure. So it was in, we're in a podcast Facebook group together, but somebody had posted on their, you know, like, "Hey, how much do you guys pay for virtual assistant for your podcast needs?" And you know, all that sort of stuff. And I got on there and I, you know, Tipity-typed my little, "Hey, if you're interested, like I, I offer services," and stuff like that, yada, yada, yada.
[00:02:56] And then Melissa saw that comment and [00:03:00] then she piggybacked off of it and was like, "Can I DM you about your services?" And then we just kind of, took it from there. She- or I DMed her and then we set up a little call and we went over like what you guys were needing and like, what I was able to do from there. I was like, I promised Lena, I was like, "I'm gonna get clients and we're gonna work together!" Because she let me stay in an apartment of hers that she was paying for, a long story. Um, and I was squatting there, so I was like, I need to pay her back somehow and in some way. But I always knew we would end up collaborating eventually because all three of us are very artistic and stuff, so. I'm on social media. I can go with the trends, I can learn about it and stuff, but I need somebody else who I can tag team with that.
[00:03:45] And then also she has the added graphic design knowledge that I don't. So like exactly what you were saying, like just surrounding yourself with other people who know how to do the things that you don't and making it work for the both of you.
[00:03:59] Amy: Yeah! [00:04:00] So, I I love that. I love that. And you know, one thing that, that I know took me a minute, and I love that you already know this, to, to realize is that it's okay to not know everything.
[00:04:11] You know, it's okay to not have the answers for everything. I think, you know, part of me being a social worker for so long and being in the front lines and being in the trenches and people having like really high acute crisis and things needing things right away, I think there was something inside me that felt like, I have to have all the answers, but I realized like a long time ago, I don't have to have all the answers. I can, you know, resource out, I can ask people. So I love that you know, that, that you knew you wanted to collaborate with your sister and you knew that, um, she had talents that you don't and you can compliment one another.
[00:04:48] So are you, are you bringing her in also Catherine, because you feel that, pay her back and then give her exposure as well?
[00:04:57] Catherine: Yeah. Oh, a hundred percent. Cause it's, [00:05:00] Interesting because our generation, our age group, I think we all have this kind of idea of like, we don't wanna do the nine to five anymore and,
[00:05:09] Amy: Yes.
[00:05:09] Catherine: You know, that sort of thing. So, and it's also the big sister in me. Like I, I'm doing what I want with my life, you know, I don't wanna do not- creative things and I don't wanna hear the "you don't make money doing music and-" you know, all that stuff. So I was like, "well, I'm gonna go and prove you wrong." Um, and I knew both of my sisters were kind of in that same head space too, but I felt like I had a better understanding in terms of how to achieve it and not, in any way of like, "Oh, they can't do it." It's just like, it's hard. So I was like, "Go, go, go, go, go." You know, we're sisters, so we talk about our lives and our frustrations and everything, and I was just hearing like, "Well, I don't wanna work a regular job. I don't wanna do this, I don't wanna do that." And it also aligned with my own goals of like, "well, I don't wanna do that either, and I wanna help [00:06:00] her." Like I've already had terrible job experiences and, not that I don't think that shaped who I am today, but if I could help Lena avoid that and just get her right into doing what she wants and prepare her, then like prepare her, like "get her rich!" Out of the trenches! But.
[00:06:15] Marielena: I like the nine-to-five discussion too with creative people. Because I actually was talking to my friend about this. We were just in the car and I was talking about it. I was like, "I'm not built for a nine to five. Like I physically can't do it." I worked, I wanna say three different jobs and I would come home crying all the time.
[00:06:32] I was like, "I can't do this. Like, I'm not, This sucks! This is miserable! I hate it." And my friend, she's just driving and she goes, "Well Lena, you're, you are a creative like, that's who you are, you're an artist. Like, you guys aren't meant- like, that's not how you function. Like you're meant to be creating all the time. That's that's why you're having a hard time." And I was like, "Oh."
[00:06:53] Amy: Kind of Like a relief to hear that? Like knowing like, okay, that that's something that I'm just, it [00:07:00] doesn't feel right. It doesn't feel like, it's almost like you're going against the waves in a way. You know?
[00:07:06] Marielena: It feels like the world isn't really built around us either. It's more built for people who go to these nine to fives, so it makes you feel like, "something's wrong with me! Why am I not enjoying this nine to five that I have? Why is everyone else able to just get up and go to it and just be like, 'Yeah. My job isn't great, but I do it every day.'"And I was like, I come home every day and I'm like, "I can't do this!"
[00:07:27] Catherine: See, I find it really interesting because, we're told, and our society kind of functions in a way where there is that conception of like, artists and creatives don't make a lot of money and it's not a real career and it's just a passion, a hobby, yada, yada, yada. But then it's like if you really go around every day and you look and you listen and, you know, interact with everything around you. It was done by a creative person. The music that you're listening to in the elevator, the pattern on this chair, like [00:08:00] everything, the, the house you're in is architecture. That's, you know, everything in our society is so, dependent on these creative people, but it's so like brushed off as like, "meh,"
[00:08:12] Marielena: I think people just think that the stuff just appears.
[00:08:15] Amy: They don't even think about it, maybe, you know, they don't even think about the process behind it. Yeah. This is, it's so interesting. And, and that is because I, I'm of the Gen X generation, you know, and, and my generation definitely wasn't so much like the baby boomers, like they had jobs for 40 years with, you know, the big three, the big three automotive, or they were in, in careers for 30, 40 years kind of thing.
[00:08:41] Where my generation definitely, I've, I've been in the field of social work for about 30 years, but I've had a handful of different jobs within it, you know, or I should say different careers within it. But really, it's interesting because do you feel like since Covid hit that [00:09:00] you have more opportunity to do your creative work and it's more quote unquote "justified" as opposed to going into an agency or an actual brick and mortar building?
[00:09:14] Marielena: Well, Covid hit my senior year of high school, so I had to finish highschool through a computer.
[00:09:20] Amy: Mm-hmm.
[00:09:21] Marielena: So everything was shut down and I was like kind of thriving because I'm a little introvert and I'm like, "I don't have to go anywhere!" And "I do art in my room anyways. I send art online, I do art this way and that that doesn't require interacting with people!" and I was like, the more I was doing stuff at home, the more I was realizing that my industry is mainly, you know, remote. You can work from home. And it was making me very hopeful. This was before I knew that, you know, like the nine to five thing, I was, I was like worried I was gonna have to be stuck doing something I didn't want to do.
[00:09:54] And I was like, "well, the industry that I'm going in allows me this window of [00:10:00] being able to stay at home," and they don't have to pay for you to be there. Or like, you know, the transportation of getting there. They, there's companies that prefer you to stay home because that's less stuff that they have to pay for. And I was like, "I can stay home! I can make my home, I can make my office at home!" And, and well, you know, this pandemic is like, helping people realize that a lot of their jobs don't require them to be in the office. Like they can do everything from home, just as fine and, and the same as if they were in the office doing it.
[00:10:28] Catherine: I actually had like a, an opposite reaction. Obviously creative, there's so many different types and like with where I am specifically, in that umbrella term is like, music and like media and like, Film and production sort of stuff. So I actually felt that the pandemic had this like bump to my creativity? Because I like to collaborate with people and most of my work involves being a part of a team or like being with people. But it did let me think about like, "Oh, well what [00:11:00] can I do as just myself as a creative, like, what projects could I work on and what skills could I develop?" And I, I was put into a new environment where I was like, "Oh, what, what can I do without the resources that I've been used to?" And I was in college, so all of my classes were still in my degree, still. So I had a video production class and we had, before the pandemic, you know, the shutdown happened, we had already like a final project and stuff like that. And then everything got switched around. So I did like a documentary style, like being at home and,
[00:11:32] Amy: Okay, cool.
[00:11:33] Catherine: And that kind of got me interested and like, "oh! Well I don't need other people to just like exercise my skills. Like I can do stuff on my own." And then that's when I started a podcast because I had another podcast class the next semester, so that fall of 2020. And then me, Tina, and Lena started our little podcast. And then as we started to do that, I was like, "Oh, well I could do this on my own too!" So that was kind of a timeline for us.
[00:11:59] Amy: You started [00:12:00] branching and Yeah, and I think it's, you know, it's, it's so different. It, it's so different for every industry too. Because I was in healthcare at the time and my job was going into, Hospitals and working with families. So there was no way, there was, you know, you couldn't like just stay inside and in my room, although it was tempting and I wanted to at times, but it's so interesting, everybody had such a different experience with, with the pandemic and how it impacted it, especially being in high school and college, you know, you're not even like grown up really, or you're not even experienced or you don't have like all- and I'm not trying to say like, you're a little baby or anything, but just in terms of like being in your career like me, who's been in the, you know, around the sun a thousand years practically, you know, so it's, it's really different. I'm, I'm really intrigued with, you know, with the way that you're, that you think about, the, the nine to five, because you, you say nine to five of it, like, it's like burning flame.
[00:12:59] [00:13:00] Like you just, like, you repel, you know, you repel against that. So it'll be so interesting to see how you evolve and your generation evolves into the workforce because it's, it's a different mindset. You know, because oftentimes, and I don't know what your parents did for a living, but maybe you saw them in careers for all these years. Do you think that played a part in it? Or.
[00:13:23] Marielena: My dad works in retail and I see him come home all the time and he just hates it. But he likes being around his family and that's why he likes Disney so much is he likes getting to escape that. He did all of it, all of it in sacrifice like to like, you know, for his children.
[00:13:39] I'm just like, I don't wanna have to do that. I don't wanna force myself to be unhappy every day. And then come home and have to find something, and have to have something to help me escape it. I just wanna be happy all the time. You know? Not saying that he's just this depressed, miserable man, but you can tell his job is not-
[00:13:56] Amy: Has he been in retail all these years?
[00:13:59] Marielena: Yeah.
[00:13:59] Amy: [00:14:00] And what about mom? Did mom have a career?
[00:14:02] Catherine: Yeah. And I think our mom is, I mean our dad too. But obviously seeing a woman and like your mother figure in a career, she's a social worker. She got a bachelor's in social work and she was a probation officer for a really long time.
[00:14:15] And then now she does like paraprofessional work and now she's the point where she's like, I don't, you know, social work is hard. Like he is starting to get into retirement mode. But she was a career woman, so it was nice to see her go off, and she did something that she really enjoyed. And that always played a big role in, like I was saying, like seeing your mother do something and then also your father and you know, just the resilience that he even, he even had, get up and go do what he needed to, to be a father.
[00:14:45] And you know, you grow up seeing that and you're like, "Well, why- WHY?" Like, "You, you could have the best of both worlds. Like why didn't you?" And I, I also have this aspiration of like, um, because he has this little garden now and [00:15:00] everything of like, I wanna be successful so I could take some ease off of him or like both of them, both my parents like, so they don't have to keep working or just, you know, work retirement thing of like, and they can take the last part of their life and enjoy it.
[00:15:16] Marielena: I think also with our dad is that he, I don't think he was able to go to school for what he wanted. It just wasn't an opportunity for him. So he sacrificed everything I wanna say in his name for all three of his children to go to school.
[00:15:32] So we're all like, "alright, now we really gotta like-" Because he didn't get to do that. So, you know, our mother got to do what she wanted. She, she was able to do that. He just wasn't in, you know, the circumstances for him. He wasn't able to do what he wanted. So all of us are like, determined to make sure we're like, "we're doing what we want because you, you, you guys helped us!"
[00:15:50] Catherine: Yeah. And our mom was also like, I remember it being literally drilled into my brain, like, don't ever become financially, emotionally, you know, uh, [00:16:00] dependent on your significant other, like just go and be independent individuals. And I know that every time we're on the phone with them or like whatever, they're all there is like, "we're so proud of all three of you." and like,
[00:16:11] Amy: I bet they are.
[00:16:13] Marielena: They're so happy that we're all into the arts. Like that's all they talk about. It's like "my, my children are artists! They're creative people. They're-"
[00:16:20] Catherine: And that's like what I contribute to all three of us is because it starts early on when. When you have kids and like it's that same notion of like, "well art, you can't support yourself being a creative." And our parents were always like, you know, do what makes you happy and you figure it out.
[00:16:36] Amy: Absolutely. Yes.
[00:16:38] Catherine: We were born in New York and then we had moved to Florida because we were back and forth between there for family that had lived there because you know, New Yorkers, once you get tired of the cold, you move to Florida. And when we were all you know, or me and Tina, my twin, it was time to go to college, we were like, "Well, we're not going to college in Florida. Like, we're in the arts. We need to be in New York. We gotta get out here!" [00:17:00]
[00:17:00] Amy: Yeah.
[00:17:00] Catherine: And they were very supportive of that. And you know, I know some parents who are like, "No, stay in this state, or stay in this state and you're gonna-" or you know, are just very passive aggressive about, "well what are you gonna do with that degree?" or like, you know, that sort of stuff so, it really started with them like supporting us and being-
[00:17:19] Amy: Yes!
[00:17:20] Marielena: I think most of that hate from, that I've got of like," Well, what are you gonna do with that? Artists aren't making money." Are from people like, that aren't my family. Like our family I wanna say, is very supportive. It's other people that are like, "Well blah blah blah!"
[00:17:33] Catherine: Well, my first boss at TJ Maxx, Terry, I don't remember her last name, but she was so rude! We were just talking, you know, she was like, pretending to wanna get to know me. And, um, she was like, "Well, what are you gonna do? Uh, where are you gonna, What are your plans?" And I was like, "Well, I think I wanna go into music and stuff like that."
[00:17:50] She literally looked at me and went, "You know, there's not really any money in music." And I go- well, first of all, Lie. Like? What do you [00:18:00] mean? What do you mean there's no money in music?
[00:18:02] Amy: You're like, "We're working at TJ Maxx, Terry."
[00:18:05] Catherine: Yeah. I kept my opinions to myself at that time and I was just like, Okay, miss a manager of TJ Maxx, because you're rolling in Dough, I'm sure. Like she was like, "My husband's in music and he doesn't really make that much." And I'm like, Okay Yep, yep. I remember saying to her, "Well, I'd rather be happy doing something that I enjoy and making enough to live then making a bunch of money doing something I hate."
[00:18:29] Amy: Yeah.
[00:18:29] Catherine: And now you see, they do all these researches of, money does not make you happy and it
[00:18:34] Amy: No.
[00:18:34] Catherine: It never will.
[00:18:35] Certain price point that it will, but once you reach that threshold, it doesn't. And then you look at all these famous people who have all of the money in the world, and then, now they have severe mental health issues because,
[00:18:46] Amy: Yeah.
[00:18:46] Catherine: They have the anxiety of like, "Oh my god. I have, I could have anything."
[00:18:50] Amy: It has to start inside. I mean, at the end of the day, it's gotta start inside. I mean, money can definitely make things more comfortable for [00:19:00] people, but you know, in, was, was Terry like your first negative response? Is that why you think she made such an impression?
[00:19:09] Catherine: I think so, because it was my first job, and up until that, like I didn't really know what I wanted to do until I was a junior in high school and like that was when I started working there.
[00:19:20] So, and then up until then I think I wanted to be like an architect or like engineering, something like technical like that. And I was like, oh my God. Yeah. I wanted to be a cake designer when I was younger.
[00:19:29] Amy: That's the artist though.
[00:19:30] Catherine: Yep. And uh, yeah, our parents have always been very supportive, and family members, and I was always surrounded by, you know, my band friends or like, you know, everybody that I had was okay with it or just was young enough where they were like, "I don't have an opinion!" , you know, like, "I'm in your boat!"
[00:19:48] Amy: What instrument do you play? Or instruments?
[00:19:50] Catherine: I play, I started with the clarinet and then, so I've been playing clarinet for like 13 years now?
[00:19:58] Amy: So cool. I [00:20:00] love that.
[00:20:00] Catherine: Usually I get, "oh, Squidward plays that," but, thank you! Um, and then I learned piano on my own and then I took lessons in college and now I teach piano too. I Started learning guitar so.
[00:20:13] Marielena: Also a drum major. So she got her conducting skills in there early.
[00:20:17] Catherine: Oh, yeah. Yeah. I was always a leader.
[00:20:19] Marielena: She ran the marching band.
[00:20:21] Amy: Oh wow! That's so impressive. I mean, anybody that can play an instrument, usually you can just teach yourself. Too, Right? I mean,
[00:20:29] Catherine: Lena's a musician too!
[00:20:30] Marielena: I didn't like music. I used to play trumpet. I, I went, I started on flute and, this was like another thing that I was weird about. I was like, "I don't like playing flute. I wanna play trumpet because the valves look really fun to press!" So when we moved here, I was like, "I'm starting middle school and I'm gonna play trumpet. I'm changing my whole thing around!" And I hated it. I did not like music at all. I really just, my parents, dare I say, forced me to stay into it because I made a lot of friends, but I was miserable in [00:21:00] it. I hated going to concerts and performing, but I made so many friends and I liked having something to be a part of, but I, music was not for me. I couldn't relate to the musicians around me. They were like, "Ah, we gotta practice this!" And I was like, "no! I don't wanna!"
[00:21:15] Catherine: Yeah, that's, that's probably the only thing our parents forced us into was like, we did not do sports. Like, I remember I wanted to do soccer, but my mom was like, "I'm not being a soccer mom." I was like, "Oh,"
[00:21:28] Amy: You're like, "Oh, I forgot. It's not about you, it's about me."
[00:21:31] Catherine: My mom was in band and she really enjoyed it and you know, it worked out in her favor that thank God we all, I mean, Tina, Tina played violin. But I was the only one who like stuck to like, the music.
[00:21:43] Marielena: She threw us all into a bowl and, and shook it around and was like, "One of these has to stick to music! I know it!"
[00:21:48] Amy: I know. I, I had my boys, my older two, I had them do piano lessons for like five years and I really thought that one of them would do something and then my husband plays the drums, just all self [00:22:00] taught and I was like, really hoping one of 'em. But they love music, they listen to it. But.
[00:22:05] Catherine: As a, I didn't wanna ever be a music educator, but like, I do it because it makes money now and that's part of my freelancing stuff. But there is so much more value to learning an instrument than just being able to, you know, play an instrument like you, just like sports, you learn time management, you learn responsibility, you learn,
[00:22:24] Amy: Technique.
[00:22:25] Catherine: Yeah. You learn how to be independent. You learn how to be a part of team, you can be a leader. Like there's so many other aspects that are useful in real world.
[00:22:36] Marielena: I think that was the only thing I really liked about music was that it made my brain function, like it made my, the gears turn in there like it's dusty up here, I'll tell you what, but it gets dusty, and having to read music lines would get it moving in there. And I would feel, I would feel smart for being able to read like a difficult- and being able to like-
[00:22:57] Amy: Yes! As you should! Marielena, [00:23:00] maybe, maybe one day you will go back to it. I mean, you're not even 21 yet. Like, So Catherine, really quick, did you end up graduating from high school in Florida?
[00:23:08] Catherine: Yes.
[00:23:08] Amy: Okay, so you and your, you all, you were in Florida, but then did you both go back up to New York for college?
[00:23:14] Catherine: So I went to Manhattanville College over in like, Westchester, like White Plains. Tina, my twin, went to the Fashion Institute of Technology and she's a photographer. So it's Music and film. And then Lena is art and digital art and stuff like that. And then Tina is photography and she also has an interest in like film and stuff like that.
[00:23:36] Amy: One of the things that I just, I wanna highlight with your talents is that in all of this creativity, one thing that we really needed here at the Kindling project is a way to organize, um, our, our podcast, our social media. You know, when you bring in these two generations that have such different [00:24:00] talents.
[00:24:00] And the thing is, is that, you know, Melissa and I do this, we both have careers, we both have families, you know, we have a whole other set of responsibilities. And so the work that, that you two do, A, I couldn't do it. And B, it's like, that's why you are both so good at it. And I have, and I know Melissa and I both have so much gratitude for you two, because you are helping us organize not just our podcast, but our social media.
[00:24:25] You know, helping us get our workbooks up in, you know, in the feedback that you've given me already, Catherine, like, I wanna, I wanna send you what I've been working on, but I just can't stress to you how much I appreciate the two of you. Just you, you just seem to get it and understand like where those gaps are for us, and so I could really see your future, you know, helping, helping like our generation in a lot of ways who are coming into this industry, but only have, you know, limited skillset.
[00:24:55] Catherine: I think this is in psychology. It would, I would think it is, it's [00:25:00] Gardner's theory of multiple intelligences. The theory is that basically everybody has, they, they fit into one of these. Groups of intelligences, and you can have multiple, but there's usually one that is very strong. So music smart body smart, people smart, word smart, logic smart, nature smart, self smart, and visual smart.
[00:25:21] And that to me is like, I'm sure everybody can look within themselves and fit themselves and at least, like three, one to three boxes of like where you really, that's where your skills are.
[00:25:34] Amy: Yeah. Where you excel more.
[00:25:36] Catherine: Mm-hmm. And I think that's how people are programmed and that's why the nine to five really doesn't work sometimes is because not everybody is in their multiple intelligences box or whatever you wanna call it.
[00:25:49] And I know we're saying nine to five is like a, an umbrella term, but like, I feel like the, the notion of it is literally just, anyone who is just working to work and doesn't feel like they're enjoying their life [00:26:00] at the same time. You know what I mean?
[00:26:01] Amy: One thing though that I will say that you two have the advantage of though, is that you have parents that really supported and cultivated and helped you realize what you love and supported that, and I think that, Well, I know that unfortunately not everybody has that support, and so they go into that space of, nine to five because they don't know what it is A, that they want. They might not believe in themselves too. Like you said earlier, you both said, having that support, it makes such a difference because then you can go, you can go forth and you're like, "I can do this." Like even if it's tough, even if it feels uncomfortable or whatever. So having that support can make such a difference.
[00:26:49] Catherine: That's why when I was, you know, I reached out to Melissa and everything and I like found what the kindling project was about. I was like, "Oh, I'm already all for this. Like, this is so great." And that's [00:27:00] what I feel like the, the audience and the group, some of the women in this group maybe feel like, is like, since they didn't get that, you know, urturing and support early on, or whatever it may have been.
[00:27:12] They don't know what they enjoy or they just, they know what they enjoy, but they don't have time to do it. And that's also the, sometimes I feel like just societal pressures of being a mother and like, you know, all the other responsibilities that are stereotyped for women and that sort of stuff.
[00:27:28] Amy: And that's, and, and you're so right because, you know, the women in the Kindling project, you know, we definitely have a huge variety of women. The problem is, is that oftentimes women aren't, they're not taught in society to prioritize themselves, to prioritize their needs, which is so pathetic and sad, if you think about it. I mean, we're still having this conversation, and it's 2022.
[00:27:51] It's like, "people, wake up!" But the point is, is that we have to be able to put our oxygen mask on first before we put [00:28:00] on, you know, before we help other people. And that is a really, um, you know, oftentimes when I work with women, they, they're like, "What? That doesn't make any sense. Like I have to make sure everybody else's needs are met before I meet with- you know, I meet my own."
[00:28:12] I'm like, "No, it doesn't have to be that way." That's a tricky, that's a tricky space for a lot of people to be in. So I think that's one of the reasons why with the kindling project, maybe sometimes we don't get as much feedback. You know, I get a lot of DMs. Melissa gets DMs because people don't wanna put themselves out there in that public forum because they are worried they're gonna be judged or looked at being selfish. Or.
[00:28:37] Marielena: I had gone to school with so many people in, because I took art classes, I took any art class that I could in, in high school and I went to, I went to school with so many people in these classes that they really liked what they were doing. They liked being photographers, they like being in music. They liked being in the art, like the design classes. I had a graphic design class that there were kids in there that were just so beyond what my, [00:29:00] that class could offer them. Like, and next thing I know, I see them post like what degree they're getting or, or they share what degree they're getting. And I'm like, "what? Where- that is so different from what you-" And then when you talk to them, they're like, "Oh, well it makes really good money."
[00:29:15] And I would be like, "Well, is it what you wanna do? They're like, "I don't know what I wanna do! I, I just know this makes really good money!" I'm like, "Well, you're gonna be making good money, but you're gonna one day realize that it's not what you're happy doing."
[00:29:29] Catherine: Yeah. Well see. I think that is also, Kind of what I was saying earlier, like when we first started talking, it's rooted in the education system because, what are all the creative industries or even like social work skills and all of that. First of all, you don't learn them like with social work or anything like trade skills and stuff like that. You don't get into them until you're in college and, all of the creative fields are extracurricular. And that does something psychological. It's, it already literally has the word "extra."
[00:29:59] Marielena: [00:30:00] Setting you up to have it pushed off to the side.
[00:30:02] Oh, definitely. Oh, ladies, I can't even tell you. Like people are like, "you're a social worker. Like, are you kidding?" They're like, "Oh, there's no money." I mean, and there's not. That's the thing. I mean, there's not, but it's luckily, like I've been able to support my family and I mean, I would've had to leave the profession 30 years ago. But I believe that if you follow your passion and you follow, you know what feels right, you follow that North Star inside or you follow your moral compass or you follow, I mean, I know I've done that and, and even though it's a grind and you have to have grit, it is like so,
[00:30:38] Catherine: so rewarding.
[00:30:39] Amy: It is. I mean, I've always, even though my jobs have been really, really hard because of the work I've done, it's just where I belong. You know? I know it's right where I belong. That's a really important message is that it is gonna be uncomfortable. There is gonna be, you're gonna feel. Push, you know, you're, it's if it feels, [00:31:00] if things feel edgy, sometimes we have to move through that because that's where the growth is happening. Right when we're feeling uncomfortable, that's when the growth is happening, so we have to trust that too.
[00:31:11] Catherine: That is probably one of the biggest things is, like if people don't like being uncomfortable, and that's why the import- the work that social workers and what you do is so important is because you're teaching people, "Duh."
[00:31:24] That's what, like what you just said, that's where your growth is and everybody's, so they just wanna be comfortable because there's so many other things going on in the world and priorities we need to have that we don't wanna be uncomfortable. And the one thing that is making us money are supplying all that financial stuff for us, or even, it doesn't even have to be a financial means. Like, you can do things that you're passionate about and just do them on the side and you know, but I also think and argue that there is a way to combine them always.
[00:31:56] Amy: Yeah, I agree. I think, I think you have to be [00:32:00] patient with that process though, because you know, we're definitely a society where, we want everything like yesterday and we want it packaged nicely and it has to be perfectly tied with the bow, but you know, through, through the adversity, because I can tell you the, the times where it's been really, really challenging and, and, and full of like adversity and, and heartache and, and pain, that's whereI've grown the most In those moments. I'm like, "this is awful." Like I wanna just stay under my covers with my dogs and not come out for like a week and draw the shades. But, if, if I face these things, which I have, even though it's not pleasant, I come out and I'm like, "Whoa, I freaking just did that. I went through that and I'm, I'm here to stand on my two feet and say I survived that."
[00:32:48] You know? And, and, and part of it is just trusting ourselves too. Just trusting that we, we can get through it, even if we're uncomfortable.
[00:32:56] Marielena: Also, just know that it's okay to change [00:33:00] your mind. Because I, I, I could have been finished with my two year bachelor's degree already this past summer, but I realized it wasn't, I didn't wanna do computer animation. It wasn't when I thought it was, I tried it and it was stressing me out, and I made the decision to push my graduation date back and change it to graphic design, which I'm having so much, a much better time doing. And I also realized what my past job before this, I was a vet assistant. I worked in a clinic and I really liked the scientific and medical aspect of it.
[00:33:33] I really liked doing some stuff there that I was like, "Wow, I maybe I should have done something like this for school." But I really liked the artistic aspect of what I was doing. And one day I had that conversation with her. I was like, "I don't think I wanna do like, just basic art, like I really like studying animals and anatomy and I just dropped it when I was in high school." And she was like, "I, I really think you have the mind to do that. Like that's your calling is, something [00:34:00] artistically creative with the science and something with that." So I haven't found that yet, but I knew that's, she put that in my brain sort of,
[00:34:07] Amy: And she sounds like a good mentor. You know, someone that mentored you and taught you, and, and this is a good thing. You're 20, you're gonna be 21 soon. The good thing is, is that you still can explore that. You know, you're gonna have this two year degree, and you're right. Changing your mind is, so it's, we have to give ourselves permission to be able to change our mind and to say, "Right now, this isn't working for me. And as long as you think it through and you're, you know, you're intentional with your decisions, that's good." you know, I think that's,
[00:34:39] Catherine: I had a sort of similar, I graduated college or I had my degree and I was like manifesting, getting this one internship at Electric Lady Studios. And I got the internship. I did the internship, and then Covid happened, whatever. And now I came back, you know, into the, ready for to enter the workforce. And I was [00:35:00] like, "I gotta keep reaching out to them like I wanna work there," yada, yada, yada. I ended up working there. Mind you, this was my goal since I was like 18. Like it's a very high end, you know, it's the top recording studio in on the East coast, Jimmy Hendricks. Like there's a lot of reputation around it and I started working there and it was one of the worst experiences I have ever had in my entire life. That led me to, I literally, Quit.
[00:35:26] My mental health was terrible and I was just like, "Am I learning and doing what I really want to do?" And I had that, that check in with myself and I was like, "You know what? This isn't what I want and that's okay." And I cried about it. I quit. I had no job lined up. I just quit. And you know, my parents, again, they were a little worried because they were like, "What are you doing quitting this job without having another job lined up? What is going on?"
[00:35:49] And I was like, "I got it. Don't worry about it." I'm not staying somewhere where my mental health is deteriorating and all this other stuff. You know, I have boundaries. So I quit. I was unemployed for a couple months and then I [00:36:00] found another job and that one ended up being also terrible. And it was in my field of work, it was at a production studio.
[00:36:07] And I was just like, "this is my sign that maybe," you know, I was interested in freelancing and this is, "this is the universe telling me, just do it. Just go ahead." And you know what? The stars had aligned. Like, certain things like happened where old bosses came back to me and were like, "Hey, do you wanna start freelancing with us?"
[00:36:25] And blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And you know. But it would've never happened if I didn't quit that first job. And then, you know,
[00:36:32] Amy: Yes! I love that for you.
[00:36:35] Marielena: I was so terrified to change my degree too. Like it's very normal for people to, because once you start doing it, you then know. I was terrified to tell my parents that, because I had the conversation with Catherine first. I was like sobbing on the phone and I was like, "this isn't what I wanna do!" Like water works and Catherine's like, "Lena.", And she helped me research everything. And I was like, " My school doesn't offer many like serious illustration stuff. And she was like, "Well, you like graphic design. I feel like that's the [00:37:00] closest thing."
[00:37:00] So I was like, "Well, now I gotta prepare to tell Joe and Barbara that their daughter's changing her degree that she's been talking about her entire life." I go downstairs and I printed everything out and I showed my mom and she's like, "...okay."
[00:37:14] Amy: You're waiting for like,
[00:37:15] Marielena: The first thing she said was, "when do you graduate now?" I was like, "I pushed it a couple, like I wanna say four to six months back." But she was like, "okay." And then I told my dad, he was-
[00:37:24] Amy: You know, I'm telling you, this is one of, when I've worked with students, grad students and just whoever will listen, I say, we learn what we don't want before we learn what we do want.
[00:37:34] And it's all the process of elimination. And it's, and it's hard cuz like you were, you were both saying like, this is what you thought you wanted this, and then you start it and you're like, This is nothing what I thought it was gonna be. And that's a gift. Even though again, that's the hard, That's the lesson.
[00:37:50] That's where the lesson is. I thought this is the recording studio I wanted to be at. This is the be all end dollar. This is the program I thought I was gonna do. And then you're in it and you're like, "No, this is [00:38:00] nothing what I thought it was gonna be," but that's the gift right there, that you realize this isn't what I want, and so that you can just pivot, change the narrative, and go in a different direction.
[00:38:09] So I love that you both have had those experiences because you're right, it is the universe. It is our higher power or God or whoever it is that you believe in. If anyone that, it's something that's saying, No, you gotta, you gotta switch gears. I love that for both of you. I think that's so important and, and now like here we are, The universe has brought our paths together.
[00:38:30] I'm really, really hopeful and optimistic that you two can help us, you know, put us on the path, put us on the trajectory of, you know, continued success. And, you know, I believe like, you know, sometimes, That we're on paths that we don't know. We don't know what the end is. We don't know what that outcome is, so we just have to trust it.
[00:38:51] I mean, who knows? You know?
[00:38:54] Catherine: No, and I see, I go to therapy and what I'm always being reminded by, by my [00:39:00] therapist is that, "Catherine, you can't control everything. You can't control everything." And I feel like everybody in a sense kind of has that control issue of like, "well, I wanna know what's happening next and I wanna, I wanna know. I need to know."
[00:39:13] Amy: Yes, yes.
[00:39:14] Catherine: And, but just like you said, the, the real reality of it is we don't know. And you just have to go along and live and, you know, go with the wind.
[00:39:22] Marielena: You can't be like, "Okay, this is the pin I'm setting. I'm gonna end up right here and I'm gonna make sure of it!"
[00:39:27] Amy: I mean, we can shoot for it. We can plan for it. Always have to have a plan B. You know, that's one of my girlfriends and I, we always say there's a plan A and there's a plan B and and also, you know, you're talking about change. You know, we have to really be open to, to changing things and it's hard to do that. Trust me. I can say that because I've had to change a lot more things cause I'm older than both of you, so I've had more experience with it.
[00:39:53] And I'm not like, "Oh, I'm older than you!" Like I'm just telling you it's because I've had to do it so many more [00:40:00] times. And so part of it is just trusting. It's trusting the process. And, and that is really hard to do because you wanna control, you wanna micromanage, you wanna like have your hands and everything.
[00:40:11] But I'm telling you, it is freeing. It is so freeing to let go and give that and just like, keep that power and, and let go of what you think you wanna control. It's like, no, I just, I'm just managing myself today. That's all I gotta do is just manage myself. Because that's, that's a job in itself, right?
[00:40:29] Marielena: All I have really had is just, I'm not 100%, like I'm never gonna 100% be happy until I like, you know, half my little cottage that I've planned in my head and whatever. But I'm really happy with, you know, the fact that I'm able to have a remote job and I'm able to do some design work, and I'm able to just be home and have more time for what I want to do. I, I used to only, at the in person jobs that I had, I would really only work [00:41:00] 18 hours a week, but it was revolving, like my life revolved around it. I would always be like, "I have to go to work this at the end of the week. I have to go to work. I have to go to work." And I would push aside everything that I wanted to do because I was like, "I don't have time because I have to go to work this week. I, I've work coming up, work is coming up, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah."
[00:41:16] And I was saying, "I'm like, Lena, you only work two days a week, there are people who go every single day." And I,
[00:41:22] Amy: Yeah, like consuming you.
[00:41:24] Marielena: Yeah. I was like, "I can't do this. Like, I wish I could just have, you know, something that I can do at home by myself." I work very well independently. And this was like, Catherine talked to me about it and I was like, "Oh, it's just gonna be some small thing that she needs some help with."
[00:41:38] And then I didn't think it was gonna be like an actual like job, until she was like, "Oh yeah, I'm gonna pay you." And I was like, "Oh yeah. $30 a couple, couple weeks and whatever," and she was like, "Okay, so here's the whole thing. This is our, you know, paycheck." And I was like, "Huh." I was like, "Okay, well this, this might be a better position for me and you know, I can leave the job that I'm currently at and give [00:42:00] someone who is more happy to be there and more, you know, helpful and can offer more time with this place and take my place."
[00:42:08] I'm so happy that I can just be home and have my little deadlines and have my planner. And work with Catherine, um, of all people. I'm like, "Yay, I get to work with my sister!" and,
[00:42:19] Amy: I know that doesn't get any better than that. Are yokidding?
[00:42:22] Marielena: Catherine and I fan girl all the time when you guys say things. So we're like, "Did you listen to this part of the podcast?! That's so cute!" And we're like, "they're literally just the sweetest."
[00:42:31] Amy: Oh, I'm so glad!
[00:42:32] Marielena: Catherine was like "women." And I said "yes!" I was like, "they're just always giving us praise and love and calling," I was like, "I love being called smart!" I'm not called smart often as an artist, it makes me feel so happy. And,
[00:42:46] Catherine: That's the thing, you surround yourself with people you know, like,
[00:42:49] Amy: You're leveling up ladies.
[00:42:51] Catherine: Yep. And I, I love surrounding myself with just women who just can be mentors and stuff like that. Like there's always so much to learn [00:43:00] about from other people. And um, and even just like hearing Lena say, like, everything that she did that like that makes me happy. And that's like the big sister in me is like,
[00:43:08] Amy: Yes! Yes. Oh my gosh. It's so true. Like there's, it's so, it's so powerful. Your relationship, sisterhood is like the most powerful. It's just unbelievable. I've learned so much from Melissa working with Melissa, because she and I are really, really different. I mean, it's interesting because she's like the creative one. Although I, I feel like I'm very, a creative person too. Yoga, I crochet. I, um, love, like just I am very a creative type and I feel like I can have that avenue probably because the work I do is so like unconventional in a lot of ways. Like I never went to school to be a therapist. I didn't even like plan on ever being a therapist.
[00:43:52] I gotta be honest. But I've just, I'm really good at helping and listening to people, and so that's why I'm doing that in this like period of my [00:44:00] life. The point is, is that I'm a fan girl of you two, just so you. know. I'm like a total fan girl. Like I love, like you two are just like so awesome and I love that.
[00:44:09] It's like the sisters, the Sisters club here. So let's just see where we can take this and let's just keep going. So I wanna say thank you so much for listening to today's episode.
[00:44:19] Please give a rating and to subscribe on whatever platform you listen on to be notified whenever there's a new episode. Be sure to join our online community, The Kindling Project, Ignite on Facebook.
[00:44:32] The link is in our show notes below. Come bring your ideas, goals, and questions to the group, or we can help get one another on the path to success. No matter where you are in the process of your kindling project, there is a place for you among the rest of the women. Yes! Thank you again so much, Catherine and Marielena.
[00:44:52] I'm so appreciative of both of you. Thank you both so much, and I can't wait to have you both back again when we're like [00:45:00] way, way more successful than we already are.
[00:45:02] Catherine: Woo hoo! Thank you!
[00:45:04] Amy: Thank you both.